Treating Autoimmune Diseases with Risa Groux, CN

When Risa was diagnosed with an autoimmune disease that caused chronic inflammation and a host of other health issues, she became determined to find the root cause. Thanks to testing and subsequent dietary and supplement treatments, she was able to reverse her symptoms naturally. She quickly realized that she could help others do the same.

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Website: https://www.risagrouxnutrition.com/

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Transcript

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LeNae Goolsby: All right, Ms. Risa, thank you so much for joining us. Happy to have you on the show today.

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risagroux: Thank you for having me. It's great to be here.

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LeNae Goolsby: Yeah, well, I'm curious to get your origin story and how you came to be interested in functional nutrition, and specifically, the autoimmune natural reversal of autoimmune disease. Let's get into that.

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risagroux: Yeah. So you know, I grew up in a home where my mother was perpetually on a diet, and she was always trying to lose the 5 or 10 pounds, and my grandmother was doing the same thing at her house, and and we had these, you know, good foods and bad foods, and I was very confused because I always thought the bad foods tasted really good to me. So I had a really struggle. I struggled with my relationship with food. And sure enough, when I was in high school, I started dieting. And you know this deprivation starvation thing. And

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risagroux: and then I it took me years to kind of put my relationship together with food, realizing that it's our fuel right? And we shouldn't be choosing foods because they're good or bad. But what fuels us

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risagroux: and and then I was always interested in nutrition, and I got married and had my 1st child. We conceived, like immediately on our honeymoon, no problems, no issues. And then, when I was trying to conceive our second time it just wasn't happening, and then I would have a couple of miscarriages, and it happened for went on for a few years, and I went to a fertility specialist, and they did some testing. And next thing you know we're sitting at his desk, and he

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risagroux: pushes over a script for me and says, you've got an underachieving thyroid, and you need to take this pill, and I said, Oh, for how long? And he said, Oh, every day! And I said, No, no! For how long? And he said, Oh, for the rest of your life.

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risagroux: So I walked out of that appointment, thinking 2 major questions, right? Why is it that my thyroid is not producing the the hormone, that it was actually born to create right? And why is the doctor not even wondering why and why are we not even looking at how to have it produce what it's supposed to produce. So that kind of started me on my journey. And I started doing some research, and why I wasn't getting pregnant. And I

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risagroux: discovered that I had this very common gene mutation called Mthfr. That most people have. I test everybody in my office for it, and it can lead to miscarriages and infertility. Go figure. So I I started taking a b vitamin and methylated form, and next thing you know, I got pregnant on my own, and had a fully fine pregnancy and and started figuring out what's happening with my thyroid.

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risagroux: Few years after my son was born I went to a naturopathic doctor. They did some blood tests and realized that I now have Hashimoto's. So I'm like Whoa. So now, my thyroids actually, my body is actually creating antibodies and attacking my thyroid, thinking it's the enemy. And are we not worried about this?

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risagroux: So that's really where I stepped into gear, and I started to figure out what those root causes would be that I would have this autoimmune disease. I had never really heard of much autoimmune diseases. And I went back to school for nutrition and I became a clinical nutritionist, and then I found functional medicine and became a functional nutritionist, where we look at root causes and prevention. So that's what I did. I created a root cause list. I put it in my book, food frame.

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risagroux: I went down that list. Of course I had every single one of those root causes, so it took me a few years to address them all, but I was able to reverse my hashimoto's.

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LeNae Goolsby: That's cool, just out of curiosity. What were you doing before you went back to school for nutrition?

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risagroux: Yeah, I was completely when I before I got married. I was director of marketing for the the hockey team, the ducks, the mighty ducks at that time.

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LeNae Goolsby: Oh no!

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risagroux: When I had my children I stopped working, but I was always reading books on nutrition, and I I kind of used my kids as guinea pigs, because I never gave them sugar, and you know, fake foods. I just gave them real food and see how they did, and they were not as sick as the other kids. Right? They didn't have perpetual ear infections or or attitude issues or anything like that. So behavioral issues. So it was it was awesome. I was able to really see how food affects us.

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LeNae Goolsby: Right.

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LeNae Goolsby: did I? You? You may you make you made your own children's baby food from scratch.

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risagroux: Yup!

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LeNae Goolsby: So like that woman on that movie Diane was that Diane Keaton movie?

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LeNae Goolsby: where she was making the you know what I'm talking about. It's an eighties movie.

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risagroux: Yeah, I don't remember that one.

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LeNae Goolsby: Working mom working mom, I think it was working mom.

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risagroux: Oh, maybe that one. Yeah.

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LeNae Goolsby: Yeah, so, yeah, so how was that process? That sounds like a major undertaking.

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risagroux: It really wasn't a lot, because you would just take vegetables or fruit, or whatever it is that you were having. And you I would steam it, and then I would puree it and put maybe a little bit of almond or coconut milk in there, and

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risagroux: and there there is a food.

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risagroux: Well, yeah, awesome.

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risagroux: Sprinkle a little sea salt so you can get some minerals. And they had real food.

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LeNae Goolsby: Very cool, very cool. I bet that helped them growing up be acclimated to more vegetables and proteins. I know that's a struggle with a lot of kids. I know my kids were like carbivores for the longest time before they would venture into proteins, and even to this day, even as teenagers. It's a struggle to get them to eat something green.

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risagroux: Yeah, it's funny. I always said in my house you have to eat something from the farm before you eat something from the factory, and I always had a plate of vegetables with hummus or olives, or something from the farm that they could have when they came home from school. So I made it accessible for them, and

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risagroux: both of them are out of the house, and after they've graduated from college and they both meal prep. And they both eat a lot of vegetables.

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LeNae Goolsby: Nice

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LeNae Goolsby: nice.

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LeNae Goolsby: Well, talk about some of the misconceptions that you run into in your practice with respect to autoimmune diseases.

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risagroux: So a lot of people come into my office with an autoimmune disease, and they have gone to the doctor. And the doctor basically gives them a pill. I I say, that's squirt gun, because we have a raging fire in the basement right? When we have autoimmunity, we have major th 17 gets activated, it becomes a cytokine storm. We have major systemic inflammation, and if we don't put that fire out, we're likely to accumulate more autoimmune diseases.

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risagroux: So when they go to the doctor, typically conventional medicine, you know, the the paradigm is a pill for nail, so they give you a pill, and you know. Perfect example is, I'm working with this woman right now. Sort of sort of at the tail end. She doesn't really need me anymore. But she came to see me late thirties, and she was in full body pain from rheumatoid arthritis. For she was about a 7 or an 8 out of 10 every single day she.

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LeNae Goolsby: Thirties.

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risagroux: Yeah, in her thirties with 3 kids. One of them was special needs. So she was like not sleeping great. And she had major skin issues blisters on her hands and all she would have hives. It's really bad.

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risagroux: I don't know how she sustained a life like that, and and debilitating fatigue. So we changed her diet, and I did my my blood panel and my stool test, and we we were able to. I put her on the Aip protocol, which is the autoimmune protocol for 90 days, and every single symptom went away.

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risagroux: Every single.

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LeNae Goolsby: And 90 days.

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risagroux: In less than 90 days, about 60 days, I would say maybe even earlier than that. And she went back to the Rheumatologist, and he walked in, and he said, How's that pillow going? And she goes. Well, I don't know. And he said, What do you mean? And she said, I've never taken it, he said. How are you doing? She goes. I'm completely out of pain, of course. I think she lost 35 pounds along the way, because weight loss is a side effect of wellness. So we focused on her wellness and she was able to reverse that. Now I don't know we didn't. We haven't tested her yet for her ra markers

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risagroux: again to see if she's still creating those antibodies. But she's completely asymptomatic.

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LeNae Goolsby: Nice.

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LeNae Goolsby: And so what? So that program is it specifically just focusing on nutritional changes.

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risagroux: Yes, the Aip protocol is a nutritional program. But anybody who comes into my office with any kind of antibodies. I'm going to give them my Fab. 5. So that's vitamin d omega

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risagroux: resveratrol, turmeric, and glutathione, our master Antioxidant. So that is going to be. It's like the fire hose for this fire that's raging right? And so that and their food, we're putting them on a fully anti inflammatory program for again, 90 days. And it works. I mean. It's just amazing. I did it myself. I've done it for a ton of people. I've seen some really amazing things reverse.

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LeNae Goolsby: Nice? So is all the foods like. Do you do any allergy testing or any genomic

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LeNae Goolsby: panel? And looking at, you know, any genetic predisposition to foods.

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LeNae Goolsby: Does that make sense.

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risagroux: So I do. Yeah, I do a lot of genetic testing, but it's optional. I don't say that it's mandatory for everybody. If somebody wants to see what their genetics are to nutrients. Absolutely. I'm a big encourager, because

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risagroux: it's really what loads the gun right? Our lifestyle and our environment is what pulls the trigger, but it is really good to know. And I used to when I 1st started my practice decades ago. I would just do it a food allergy test. I'm like, this is awesome. We have all this data, what you can eat, what you can't eat. And then I started realizing that some people can't really hardly eat anything. And I realized this was not the point

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risagroux: problem. This was the symptom of the problem. The problem was that we had this major leaky gut and these

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risagroux: gap gaping holes in the intestinal lining, that these foods were going in through the intestinal lining, going in through the back door, and the body says, Who are you? You're the enemy, and it starts to create antibodies right? And they've been probably doing this for a long time, because those antibodies eventually need to find a place to park. They're going to look for a gland, a cell, or an organ in which to park itself. Right? That's where we get autoimmune disease.

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risagroux: So I'm really looking at the leaky gut. Everybody in my office gets a stool test. So I'm looking to see how leaky you are. But are you creating your own digestive enzymes? How do you do with fat malabsorption? What's your inflammation? So on and so forth. I'm looking at the good guys, the bad guys, any overgrowth? I'm looking at Giardia H. Pylori, worms, parasites, fungus yeast.

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risagroux: and then I do a full extensive blood panel. So I want to see all your inflammation markers where conventional medicine does not test for that which is insane to me. So I look at vitamin DI look at an iron panel. I'm looking at 4 markers of blood sugar. I'm looking at 9 markers of thyroid, not just your tsh, but all 9 markers of your thyroid antibodies as your or your hormones affecting your thyroid? And is your

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risagroux: your inflammation or your cortisol production affecting your thyroid. And at that point I have a really good idea of where we're going next. Right? So what is unique to you and that and then we do with a food program. But while we're collecting that data, you're on my detox for 2 weeks while we're quelling the inflammation in in the system and taking out the foods from the factory.

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LeNae Goolsby: Okay trip. You have any. Have any thoughts. You're muted.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: Yeah, no, that's that's because of our our.

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LeNae Goolsby: Clarks.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: Pets.

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LeNae Goolsby: Yeah.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: But so yeah, no, I find it, you know.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: ultimately very refreshing to to hear kind of the confirmation of all the things that that I've seen over the last decade or 2 doing doing the integrative and functional component of our

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Trip Goolsby, MD: interestingly, interestingly, I kind of fell on to that coming out of conventional oncology and and with the the nutritional aspect and all that.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: it's really interesting to see that, you know, I'd have patients with lupus and rheumatoid arthritis and these autoimmune disorders, and I'd I'd get them on this on a low inflammatory or or low carb and

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Trip Goolsby, MD: isolate those things that that they seem to be reacting to, and then oops all of a sudden, you know their their lupus is gone. The symptoms and signs of the arthritis are gone. The the basically the end organ dysfunction modifies itself and comes back into a and into normal functioning parameters

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Trip Goolsby, MD: wonderful stuff, wonderful stuff and and all, just by by virtue of the fact of taking care of what we need to be getting into our into our system so that we're not accosting our genome.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: And you know, and

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Trip Goolsby, MD: really just fascinating stuff. And I, you know and it. And it puts an end. It actually puts an end to that, to that

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Trip Goolsby, MD: to that suffering, that that we we

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Trip Goolsby, MD: unfortunately inherited behavior, wise from our from our predecessors, our parents and our grandparents, and all that, all that. We got good stuff. But it really wasn't good stuff.

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risagroux: And things they didn't really teach you in medical school. I'm assuming.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: No, no, absolutely not absolutely not. And you know, I think that also the the fact that we have a a much better idea of

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Trip Goolsby, MD: of the biological aging process, and the the role of even minute amounts of inflammation and and toxic environment in our body now is is really is really bringing all to the fore that we can can really probably avoid a lot of the a lot of the damage to our genome, or are costing the genome, so to speak, with

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Trip Goolsby, MD: by just, you know, just living and eating well and going back to the roots.

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risagroux: Yeah, eating foods from the earth. Right?

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Trip Goolsby, MD: Exactly.

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risagroux: As it turns out, food actually matters what you eat has a major impact in your health.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: Yeah, and the and the whole field of nutragenomics. It's that's, you know, just flowering at this point. We're getting all this information that's coming out, and you you had the had the well, maybe the good fortune of of finding out you had an Mthfr. Mutation that that predisposed to just a ton of things because of the the cellular impact of of the non non methylation of folic acid. So

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Trip Goolsby, MD: really, really fascinating stuff, and that I'm really encouraged. I, you know, actually, a lot of this starts are from the West coast. It's taking a little longer to get get this direction, I think. Certainly in in the hub of obesity and

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Trip Goolsby, MD: and nutritional toxicity here in New Orleans we're we're, you know, slowly but surely gaining gaining ground. But really interesting to see the results and the fantastic results that we get with the inflammatory disease processes.

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risagroux: Yeah, I think the frustration, at least what I experience from most people that come into my office. I'm the last stop, you know. They're just. They've been to several physicians. They don't have answers. They still feel like crap. They're on more medications. And it's this bad paradigm that we have, and it's not the doctor's fault, right? Because it's what they've been taught. And then.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: Exactly.

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risagroux: Right, and then we nurture them with the pharmaceutical companies and the insurance companies say, Oh, you want to run your own practice. Well, we're going to tell you how to do it right?

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risagroux: Want to get paid. We're gonna tell you how it's gonna work, right? So your hands are tied.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: Exactly.

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risagroux: It's really it's it's got to be super frustrating for for physicians. And I can tell you that the average person who is diagnosed with an autoimmune disease, sees 6 physicians before that diagnosis.

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LeNae Goolsby: Wow!

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Trip Goolsby, MD: And and I, you know I agree. I agree with you know everything you say. The the the

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Trip Goolsby, MD: paradigm is what's driving the driving the issue, unfortunately. And and it's a it's

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Trip Goolsby, MD: an an unfortunate disaster that what we learn in medical school granted, all the basics are there. The science is there and all that. But towards the end, as we're as we're taught how to address the issues, the it goes immediately to either a pharmaceutical or a procedure or some some type of manipulation that actually does not address

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Trip Goolsby, MD: the the cause of the problem. It's the end result. And the symptom of the problem that's being addressed. And so getting back to, as you said, getting back to these the roots and and getting good nutrition in. And that is just just so key to, to resolving so many of the medical problems that we have today.

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risagroux: Yeah.

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risagroux: absolutely.

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risagroux: And I work with a lot of physicians as patients. And I love that because they haven't a great, you know, an outsized impact on who they're they're teaching and who they're helping. So I love that and I do. I do have hope. For the 1st time I feel like the functional message is louder than it's ever been.

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risagroux: and I think we're people are are sick and tired of being sick and tired, and I think they're really embracing. A a different way of healthcare.

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LeNae Goolsby: Yeah.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: And you're right. It's always many of the of the people that I see that I see at the end of the day. Are are addressing problems that multiple physicians have been involved. And you know, biopsies and this and that and all these, all the technology that's been applied. And then at the at the end of the day there's still no answer, and they're getting a symptomatic treatment or a highly toxic symptomatic treatment with the pharmaceutical.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: and that can be resolved

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Trip Goolsby, MD: easily, easily, just by changing by well, lifestyle changes, and I guess not easy sometimes, but.

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risagroux: But it has a major impact.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: That's that's the impact that that's where it is.

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risagroux: Exactly.

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LeNae Goolsby: Right? Yeah, I I find it interesting, though, when you're asking somebody to engage in behavioral modification with the way that they've been eating their whole life, it can be quite the challenge. What do you see with respect to that? Like? What are your clients most struggling with? Is it? Is it that they're being asked to, you know, cause you can feel like you're depri being deprived

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LeNae Goolsby: because you can't have this thing because this isn't serving you, and you've got to swap it for this thing that will serve you to find patients are resistant to that.

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risagroux: The 2 major hurdles. I really find people having a hard time with is wine. Wine is a big one.

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risagroux: and sugar.

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LeNae Goolsby: Oh!

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risagroux: Big one, too, but you know it is, we have so much more involved in food because we have a lot of emotion tied to it right where we reward ourselves, we punish ourselves, we we celebrate with food. We use food for so many different things that we don't actually use when we brush our teeth right. We don't drive home from work going. Oh, my gosh! I hope I have so much toothpaste in my toothbrush! You know my toothbrush.

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risagroux: my toothpaste dube, because I'm just gonna brush my teeth a lot right. But we are thinking, oh, my God! I hope there's some cherry pie left in the refrigerator. Because I'm gonna dive into that right? So it's a different. We have a different emotional attachment to food. And it's very cultural and different cultures have different rituals with with food. So it's it's even though it's our fuel source, just like we have to brush our teeth. It's we have a

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risagroux: completely different mindset with it, because it's very emotional. So people come in and there are some people who just can't make changes right, and no matter what we do, they're just not there yet.

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risagroux: I believe they'll get there at some point, because I always say you get what you get when you do what you do right. It goes both ways right. If I would get up and I work out most days I'm gonna get what I get right. But if I decide to eat twinkies instead, I'm gonna get what I get. So it it it. It's it's really the difference between who you are and who you want to be is what you do. So right? And so it's little baby steps every time you're taking something into your mouth. Is this a food that's going to help me or hinder me.

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risagroux: So it and and what do you really want? Sometimes people say they want, but they don't really, really really want it. They're not willing to do the work right.

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risagroux: And I always say to people, I work, I've I'm very fortunate. I've met many, many very successful people, and I am friends with an elite athlete who is one of the most decorated athletes of our time, and I've been able to work with athletes, and I've worked with artists and people who are quite successful in business or people who are very successful in relationships. It doesn't matter where your success is, they all possess the 2 same attributes.

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risagroux: One is sacrifice. You have to make some sacrifice even when you don't feel like it, and the other is consistency.

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risagroux: Even when I don't feel like, you know, going and working out, I'm gonna do it, anyway, even if I don't feel like having that salad instead of the chips and guac. I'm gonna do it, anyway, and I may have a little chips and guac, or I may do it another time. But I'm 99% of the time going to choose the the real food, the protein fat and fiber. Right? So it's those little decisions that that make health right? Just like it makes any success

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risagroux: in anything that you do right. When I talked to that that world decorated athlete, you know he he didn't make it ever. He never went to a high school football game.

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risagroux: and I was shocked, you know, and I said, you've never been to a high school football game. Is it a full grown adult in his forties? He said. No, I was, you know I went to the pros when I was 15. So what a sacrifice that was for him! He missed all his high school fun, right? He missed a lot of things for his kids because he was on the road, so we don't tend to look at his sacrifices.

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risagroux: We look at a celebrations, but behind every successful person or entity is a lot of sacrifice.

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LeNae Goolsby: Yeah.

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LeNae Goolsby: something's going to give somewhere.

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risagroux: Yeah, you gotta earn it somehow. Right? Nothing's given to any of us.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: Gotta give to get gotta give to get.

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risagroux: Exactly.

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LeNae Goolsby: Cool. You have a book food frame.

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LeNae Goolsby: Talk about that.

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risagroux: Yeah. So food frame is my methodology that I created after doing nutrition for years and years and years, and I would put everybody on the same anti inflammatory protocol. I realized that some people were excelling and some people weren't. So I realized we probably should be eating very differently. And I now believe that we should all be eating according to our current health status.

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risagroux: So if you have Ibs or sibo, small intestinal bacteria overgrowth, you probably should be eating a low fodmap program for 30 to 90 days, and if you have autoimmunity, you should be eating, you know, take out nightshades and eating more of an aip protocol. Perhaps you have some blood sugar dysregulation, and if you qualify for all the things that would make up a successful keto program.

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risagroux: That's something I would recommend. So and then I talk. I break down 6 different major diet types that I usually work with in my office.

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risagroux: and I have a lot of stories in there. I give a lot of information, and and so that's my my food, my methodology. And it's been working 100% for everybody. Everybody seems to thrive when you eat according to your health status, and when your health status changes, so does your diet type, right? So you're eating a different. Maybe you're eating more nuts or seeds, or whatever it is for you that you hadn't been before in order to heal, and then, once you're healed you can eat differently.

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LeNae Goolsby: No, I like that idea

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LeNae Goolsby: very cool, alright.

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risagroux: New book, right? That comes out by some, you know, amazing person. And everybody's reading it. And you know, 60% of the people are thriving, but you do it, and you're like, something's wrong with me. Why am I not thriving on this right? It's it's because of that right.

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LeNae Goolsby: Yeah. Well, you know, people can get lost in information

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LeNae Goolsby: overload.

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risagroux: for sure.

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LeNae Goolsby: For sure. And okay. And then you have a you have an online, is it a do it yourself? Thyroid.

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LeNae Goolsby: They were not.

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risagroux: Course for thyroid, because I went through every which way and back. And so I put everything I know into the thyroid course it's called achieving optimal thyroid health, and I break down. If you have hyper or hypo, or hashis, or graves, or thyroidectomy, and what supplements to take, what supplements not to take, what foods to eat, what foods, not to eat, and, most importantly, how to read your blood work. Ask your position for these particular markers

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risagroux: how to interpret them. What's optimal and what's what's you know, where you should start paying attention.

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LeNae Goolsby: Cool.

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LeNae Goolsby: Okay.

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LeNae Goolsby: What is one thing you want the listeners to know.

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risagroux: I would really urge people to look at their toxic load. We have more toxins in our society than we ever have. We are at 86,000 chemicals approved by the FDA more than any other country on this planet. Most of them aren't even tested.

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risagroux: and we're at about 2 to 6,000 approved per year, regardless of who's in the White House.

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risagroux: So this is something that we have some control over. It's our our candles, our shampoos, conditioners, our beauty products, our nail, polish, our every, all your house cleaning and your food. So if you, if you read a label and it sounds like a chemical, and you don't have it in your pantry. Probably best not to eat it.

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risagroux: So I really urge people to detoxify or just decrease their toxic load because it is very damaging. And I think we're going to see a tremendous amount of infertility in the future, because we are just really causing havoc on our endocrine system.

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LeNae Goolsby: And and you you have a detox program as well. Right.

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risagroux: Yes, I have the Rgn detox, and it is collagen shakes collagen plus amino acids and antioxidants that help gently open up pathways one and 2 for gentle detoxification, and it's 2 shakes a day, and then you're eating protein, fat and fiber. I'm a big fan of protein, fat and fiber at every meal, every shake, and then you are eating real good food, protein and all the vegetables you want, any way you want them, except for deep fried, so it might be difficult for some people.

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LeNae Goolsby: For sure!

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risagroux: Sweet potato yams and good fats, eggs, nuts, seeds, olives, olive oil, avocado, avocado, oil, coconut, coconut oil.

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risagroux: people do lose weight, but it is not a weight loss program, but it is a side effect of wellness. We store toxins in our fat cells. So that's why we lose weight. But you want to clean those toxins out of the system and optimize your function of your liver and all your other organs.

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LeNae Goolsby: And how long is that? It's a is that a 90 day or 2.

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risagroux: 2 days, 14 days.

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LeNae Goolsby: Okay, 14 days.

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LeNae Goolsby: And then is there a maintenance protocol? After that.

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risagroux: Well, I do recommend to take my food frame quiz on my website to find out what is your food frame. So after that detox. You'll or you can do it before the detox, and just make

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risagroux: tweaks along the way of what is works for you.

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LeNae Goolsby: Cool alright, and then where can everybody find that and more information about you?

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risagroux: Yeah, on my website at Risa, RISA gru GROU. X. nutrition.com. My course is on there. My product line. That is super super clean. My detox is on there. My book is on there, and tons of testimonials and information as well, and the food frame. Test. Quiz. Yeah.

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LeNae Goolsby: Cool. Okay. Well, listener, you definitely want to go there. And I think Risa was generous in giving us a code.

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risagroux: Yeah, we're gonna do infinite 10, the number 10, for 10% off the Rg and detox and I work with people all over the country. So I do it via zoom. So you can just head to the website and get in touch with us, and we'll get you scheduled.

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LeNae Goolsby: Awesome.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: Great, great, that's great. I have a patient that

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Trip Goolsby, MD: that I think would really benefit from having a

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Trip Goolsby, MD: discussion with you.

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risagroux: Excellent! Well, we can watch them heal together.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: Autoimmune issues. Young woman, yeah.

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Trip Goolsby, MD: Days. Yeah.

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risagroux: Yeah.

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LeNae Goolsby: Cool. Alright. Yeah, we'll talk about that later.

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LeNae Goolsby: Alright, Risa, thank you so much for all that information I learned a lot. Listener. I hope you learned a lot as well, and I hope you found it.

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LeNae Goolsby: I don't know what I say, interesting, educational, somewhat entertaining, and until next time.